Author Topic: Shaman help  (Read 2760 times)

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Offline Nerdanel

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Shaman help
« on: August 28, 2007, 11:45:28 PM »
I was wondering if there could be a part on this part of the site with hints and tips for shamans since it's completely new to the alliance. I have a shaman and I still have trouble finding armor and other things so all help is welcome
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Offline Joggers

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« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2007, 11:56:02 AM »
Quote from: Nerdanel
I was wondering if there could be a part on this part of the site with hints and tips for shamans since it's completely new to the alliance. I have a shaman and I still have trouble finding armor and other things so all help is welcome

What lvl armor and things are you interested in? Lower lvl stuff or pre-raiding gear?



Offline Joggers

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« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2007, 01:01:18 PM »
Well, if it's higher lvl stuff you're interested in I have acces to some nice lists of gear available through quests and 5-man instances for enhancement shammies + a lot of other info about high lvl shammies. Just lemme know what you're interested in and I'll have a look into it.



Offline Splishy

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« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2007, 02:21:52 PM »
Nerda's Shammy is in the 40-50 region unless I'm much mistaken...
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Offline Joggers

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« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2007, 04:51:49 PM »
Quote from: Splishy
Nerda's Shammy is in the 40-50 region unless I'm much mistaken...

Any idea what specc?



Offline Splishy

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« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2007, 05:05:39 PM »
There's no data on the Roster, but Armoury says Enhancement

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xm...&n=Shamanix
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Offline Nerdanel

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« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2007, 08:11:50 PM »
yeah my shammy is 45 atm. Been trying to get rpgo characterprofiler back up for tha last few days with no succes. I'm looking for general group tactics, armor I should aim for and that kind of stuff. Been browsing the official forums but there is so much to read and alot of it is just nonsence. I love fighting with my shammy but would love to get him powered up

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Offline Joggers

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« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2007, 08:30:59 AM »
Quote from: Nerdanel
yeah my shammy is 45 atm. Been trying to get rpgo characterprofiler back up for tha last few days with no succes. I'm looking for general group tactics, armor I should aim for and that kind of stuff. Been browsing the official forums but there is so much to read and alot of it is just nonsence. I love fighting with my shammy but would love to get him powered up

I've mostly looked into end-game stuff, but the same tactics should be able to be applied to 60- as well. I'll see if I can find any info and copy it here  

EDIT:
Here's a post about bringing enhancement shammies to raids, but the same benefits should go for regular groups as well:
_____________________________________________________________________
Enhancement Shaman Raid Viability
Here are some easy numbers to convince your raid leader that enhancement shamans are worthy additions to melee groups.

Strength of Earth: +86 STR, talented +98 STR

Untalented (Resto/Elemental spec)
- Rogues: 86 Attack Power
- Warriors/Shamans/Bear Druids/Paladins: 172 AP
- Cat Druids: 206.4 AP

Talented + Unleashed Rage (Enhancement spec)
- Rogues: 107.8 AP
- Warriors/Shamans/Bear Druids/Paladins: 215.6 AP
- Cat Druids: 258.72 AP

Grace of Air: +77 AGI, talented +88 AGI

Untalented (Resto/Elemental spec)
- Rogues/Cat Druids: 77 AP
-- Rogues: 1.93% Crit, 3.85% Dodge
-- Warriors: 2.33% Crit, 2.57% Dodge
-- Druids: 3.08% Crit, 5.25% Dodge
-- Shamans/Paladins: 3.08% Crit, 3.08% Dodge

Talented + Unleashed Rage (Enhancement spec)
- Rogues/Cat Druids: 96.8 AP
-- Rogues: 2.2% Crit, 4.40% Dodge
-- Warriors: 2.67% Crit, 2.93% Dodge
-- Druids: 3.52% Crit, 5.99% Dodge
-- Shamans/Paladins: 3.52% Crit, 3.52% Dodge

Totals
Unleashed Rage is +10% AP, so for every 1000 AP you have, including other buffs and potions, you gain 100 AP. Lets assume that every melee class has 2000 AP buffed, so Unleashed Rage would add another 200.

Untalented Totals (Resto/Elemental spec)
- Rogues: 163 AP
- Cat Druids: 283.4 AP
- Warriors/Shamans/Other Druids/Paladins: 172 AP
-- Rogues: 1.93% Crit, 3.85% Dodge
-- Warriors: 2.33% Crit, 2.57% Dodge
-- Druids: 3.08% Crit, 5.25% Dodge
-- Shamans/Paladins: 3.08% Crit, 3.08% Dodge

Talented Totals (Enhancement spec)
- Rogues: 204.6 + 200 = 404.6 AP
- Cat Druids: 355.52 + 200 = 555.52 AP
- Warriors/Shamans/Other Druids/Paladins: 215.6 + 200 = 415.6 AP
-- Rogues: 2.2% Crit, 4.40% Dodge
-- Warriors: 2.67% Crit, 2.93% Dodge
-- Druids: 3.52% Crit, 5.99% Dodge
-- Shamans/Paladins: 3.52% Crit, 3.52% Dodge

The attack power bonus will scale perfectly with gear. As a basic rule of thumb, enhancement shamans provide around 250 AP, 0.5% crit, and 0.5% dodge over resto/elemental shamans. Keep in mind that a flask of relentless assault is 120 AP. You can't stack pots in 2.1, so that attack power is proportionally more valuable.

These calculations are all before bloodlust or especially windfury which scales dramatically better than agility with warriors, paladins, and combat rogues.

Original Credit: Unaz <Shadow>, Mug'Thol. US
« Last Edit: September 04, 2007, 08:34:24 AM by Joggers »



Offline Distour

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« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2007, 09:28:01 AM »
Correct me if I'm mistaken here but gearwise for an enchancement shammy you're almost going for exactly the same gear as hunters may do.
Basically mail gear with agility, stamina, strength, intellect. Agility and strength because it adds to your crit% and your attackpower, Stamina since you'll be going in melee fighting and don't wanna get one hitted when/if the mob turns to you, and in the end alittle intellect doesn't hurt for those longer fights to avoid you going oom too soon.

Stat priority should be something like Agility>Stamina>=Strength>Intellect I think, stamina and strength could be somewhat equal in priority but in the higher levels I'd say the stamina will help you more then a few more points of AP since you're high crit rate will do more for you.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2007, 09:28:46 AM by Distour »

Offline Joggers

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« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2007, 09:34:00 AM »
Quote from: Distour
Correct me if I'm mistaken here but gearwise for an enchancement shammy you're almost going for exactly the same gear as hunters may do.

I'm definitely no expert on hunters, but if wanted I can copy a list of pre-raiding gear for enhancement-shammies compiled by a m8 of mine...



Offline Distour

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« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2007, 09:39:06 AM »
Quote from: Joggers
I'm definitely no expert on hunters, but if wanted I can copy a list of pre-raiding gear for enhancement-shammies compiled by a m8 of mine...
how far before preraiding? lvl70 preraiding or lower?

Offline Joggers

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« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2007, 09:42:05 AM »
Quote from: Distour
how far before preraiding? lvl70 preraiding or lower?

lvl 70 preraiding gear



Online Galathius

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« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2007, 01:56:58 PM »
I think enhancement shammies go for hunter like gear but with some strength on top.

Offline Nerdanel

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« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2007, 09:42:48 PM »
would like to see the pre raid hear for shammy's at 70 so post away also read the shammy's go for fist weapons around 70 is that true?
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Offline Joggers

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« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2007, 10:38:14 PM »
Quote from: Nerdanel
would like to see the pre raid hear for shammy's at 70 so post away also read the shammy's go for fist weapons around 70 is that true?
Might depend on what weaps you find i suppose. I'll post the compiled list of gear and a little list about maxxing out dps with enhancement shammies in a wee while...

Question: is it possible to edit items so that when you hoover over it you can see what stats it has etc? Would be useful for this one...

[!--quoteo(post=15418:date=:name=Novacat)--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE(Novacat) [snapback]15418[/snapback][/div][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--quotec--]
Wall of text on  

Gear

Head:
[Helm of Desolation] - Aeonus in Black Morass
[Stalker's Helmet of Second Sight]- Quest Reward in Shadowmoon
[Dream-Wing Helm] -Ambassador Hellmaw in Shadow Labryinth
[Far Seer's Helm] -Exalted *Alliance Only*

Neck:
[Chain of Glowing Tendrils] - Quest Reward in Netherstorm
[Earthen Mark of Razing]- Quest Reward in Nagrand
[Pendant of Triumph] - 18,000 Honor & 10 EotS Tokens
[Traitor's Noose] - Mennu the Betrayer, Slave Pens Heroic
[Talon Lord's Collar] - Sethekk Halls Quest Reward
[Choker of Vile Intent]- 25 Badges of Justice from Heroics

Shoulders:
[Mantle of Perenolde] - Epoch Hunter in Old Hillsbrad
[Pauldrons of Desolation]- Quagmirran in Slave Pens Heroic
[Towering Mantle of the Hunt]- Commander Sorannis in Botanica
[Sun-Gilded Shouldercaps]- Chrono Lord Deja in Black Morass
[Expedition Scout's Epaulets]- Shattered Halls Quest Reward *Alliance Only*

Chest:
[Hauberk of Desolation]- Epoch Hunter in Old Hillsbrad Heroic
[Chestguard of No Remorse]- Hydromancer Thespia in Steamvaults
[Salvager's Hauberk]- Lower City, Revered
[Laughing Skull Battle-Harness]- Temporus in Black Morass

Cloak:
[Sergeant's Heavy Cloak] - 11,100 Honor & 20 AB Tokens
[Netherfury Cape] - Warp Splinter, Botanica
[Auchenai Death Shroud]- Avatar of the Martyred, Auch Crypts Heroic
[Vengeance Wrap]- BoE Crafted
[Cloak of the Inciter]- Blackheart the Inciter in Shadow Labryinth
[Cloak of Malice]- Grand Warlock Nethekurse in Shattered Halls

Bracers:
[Marshal's Linked Bracers]- 11,100 Honor & 20 WSG Tokens
[Felstalker Bracers]- BoE Crafted

Gloves:
[Hungarhide Gauntlets]- Hungarfen in Underbog Heroic
[Windstrike Gloves] - BoE Crafted
[Gauntlets of Desolation]- Kargath Bladefist in Shattered Halls
[Windslayer Wraps]- BoE Crafted
[Felfury Gauntlets]- BoE Crafted

Waist:
[Girdle of the Blasted Reaches]- Omor in Ramparts Heroic
[Felstalker Belt]- BoE Crafted
[Shattrath's Champion Belt]- Arcatraz Key Quest Reward
[Rune-Engraved Belt] - Shattered Halls Quest Reward - *Alliance Only*
[Blessed Scale Girdle]- The Sha'tar, Revered

Legs:
[Greaves of Desolation] - Talon King Ikiss in Sethekk Halls
[Midnight Legguards]- Quagmirran in Slave pens Heroic

Boots:
[Wild Stalker Boots]- Watchkeeper Gargolmar, Ramparts Heroic
[Barkchip Boots]- Black Stalker in Underbog Heroic
[Outland Striders] - Zereketh the Unbound in The Arcatraz
[Boots of the Shifting Sands] - Laj in The Botonica

Rings:
[Ogre Slayer's Band]- Quest Reward in Nagrand
[Band of the Exorcist]- 50 Spirit Shards from Auchindoun Instances
[Ravenclaw Band]- Talon King Ikiss in Sethekk Halls
[Ring of the Shadow Deeps]-Ghaz'an in Underbog Heroic
[Resounding Ring of Glory]-Epoch Hunter from Old Hillsbrad Heroic
[Slayer's Mark of the Redemption]- Quest Reward in Shadowmoon
[A'dal's Command]- The Sha'tar, Exalted

Trinkets:
[Bladefist's Breadth] - Quest Reward in Hellfire Peninsula
[Hourglass of the Unraveller] Temporus in Black Morass
[Terokkar Tablet of Precision] Quest Reward in Terrorkar Forest
[Abacus of Violent Odds]-Pathaleon the Calculator in Mechanar Heroic
[Bloodlust Brooch]

Weapons: (Any between speeds of 2.4 - 2.7, such as:)
[Demonblood Eviscerator]-Kargath Bladefist in Shattered Halls
[Gladiator's Cleaver]
[Boggspine Knuckles] - Hungarfen in Underbog Heroic
[Claw of the Watcher] - Shirrak the Dead Watcher in Auch Crypts Heroic
[Reflex Blades] - Dalliah the Doomslayer in The Arcatraz
[Runic Hammer] - BoE Crafted
[The Planar Edge] - *BoP* Crafted

Totems:
[Totem of Impact] - Zangermarsh PvP Vendor, 15 Marks of Thrallmar/Honor Hold
[Totem of the Astral Winds]- Pandemonius in Mana-Tombs Heroic
[Stormfury Totem] - Quest Reward in Shadowmoon

Enchants

Helm:
[Glyph of Ferocity]- Cenarion Expedition Quartermaster, Revered

Shoulders:
[Greater Inscription of Vengeance] - Aldor Quartermaster, Exalted
[Greater Inscription of the Blade]- Scryer Quartermaster, Exalted

Chest:
[Exceptional Stats] - 345 Skill Enchanter

Cloak:
[Greater Agility] - 310 Skill Enchanter

Bracers:
[Brawn] - 310 Skill Enchanter

Gloves:
[Major Strength] - 340 Skill Enchanter

Weapons:
[Crusader] - 300 Skill Enchanter
[Mongoose] - 375 Skill Enchanter

[/quote]

And something the same guy found on the WoW forums...
Quote
Firstly your damage consists of:Windfury,stormstrike,shocks, haste and white damage.

WHITE DAMAGE:
The more you hit and crit the more you do white damage, this is a majority of shamans damage and should not be overlooked.
white damage supportting your other elements of damage output?
windfury tooltip says: "each HIT has a 20%chance of dealing..."
so as a simple conclusion the more you hit the more you get windfury attacks
you need aproximately 24% of hit in order not miss whit white attacks against bosses, so 9%from talents and 15%from gear.
Crit rate: Should be 25% this is because of FLURRY=30%attacks speed for your next 3swings so let's do some theorycraft:
1st hit crits for xxx, you gain flurry, 2nd hit hits for xxx, 3rd hit hits for xxx, 4th hit hits for xxx, flurry fades->
5th hit crits for xxx, you gain flurry,and the pattern copies itself------------->


STORMSTRIKE:
The slower weapons the bigger hits, everybody get's this


+HASTE EFFECTS:
Are nice ofcourse but don't get too much or your damage output gets negative modifier, evethough it don't look like it.
So why is that? Answer is windfury...


WINDFURY:
Has a 3second cooldown, in the current patch you can only use rank5/rank5 in order to reach out for the max dps.
Shamans are crying because in last patch it was possible to use rank5/rank4 because the 3second counter didn't work for different ranks.
SO the "dream speed" for weapons are 1.5 so that you can proc windfurys from your mainhand, this is because offhand windfurys are weaker,
than from mainhand eventho this should have been fixed.
How to reach the dream speed?
let's assumpt every selfrespecting melee shaman uses gladiator weapons(the slow ones)
those have 2.6speed so flurry gives 30%more speed -> the speed is 1.8after FLURRY
let's add the tasty trinket from Gruul, http://www.thottbot.com/i28830 this gives you a about 30%more speed, so when combined with flurry
your attacks speed drops in to 1.04 AND THAT IS FAR TOO FAST! and this is because indeed you do get more white damage,
but you get less windfury attacks. This has been mathematically proven million times before, so i'm not going to do that.
But now you should see that too much +HASTE has a negative effect to your dps as enhancement shaman.
Also notice that the more+hit you have the more windfurys you also have, but do remember the 3second rule!


SHOCKS AND FLAMETONGUE WEAPON:
Sad but true there are no way to improve the damage from your shocks instead of a crappy pvptotem http://www.thottbot.com/i27947
and the Concussion talent.
Why not flametongue weapon?
how are you going to improve your dps by any means? When you use windfury you benefit from your gear(the more AP,
the bigger windfury attacks and white hits are).THERE ARE NO MAILGEAR:that gives you +hit,+crit,ap,+spelldamage,+spellcrit,+spellhit
So at certain gear level flametongue might be as good dps as windfury, BUT you can only upgrade your windfury damage with gear,
this makes Flametongue weapon lesser.

SUGGESTION FOR TALENT BUILD:
http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/t...300000000000000
Atleast in my SSC/THE EYE raiding guild, melee is screaming for windfurytotem! so this build improves it for 30% you really can feel the difference.
Concussion is there just to max out the damage output, BUT it's not necessary you can switch this for Convection and mental quickness.


THE GEAR(just to prove that every Karazhan raiding shaman can reach for awesome dps gear)
head: http://www.thottbot.com/i29040 with glyph of ferocity, swift skyfire diamond and bright living ruby
neck: http://www.thottbot.com/i28509
shoulder: http://www.thottbot.com/i27713 let's just assumpt your scryer(meaningless but makes the calculations more accurate)2xbright living ruby
back: http://www.thottbot.com/i28672 with +15agi enchant
chest: http://www.thottbot.com/i28599 with +6all stats
wrist: http://www.thottbot.com/i28454 with assault
weapons: slow gladiator 1handers both with mongoose
totem: http://www.thottbot.com/i27815
hands: http://www.thottbot.com/i29039 with +15str
waist: http://www.thottbot.com/i28656
legs: http://www.thottbot.com/i27936 because of the 2part setbonus! nethercobra leg armor
feet: http://www.thottbot.com/i28746 any enchant and 1x crit gem, 1x hit gem (swift skyfire reguirements)
ring1: http://www.thottbot.com/i28757
ting2: http://www.thottbot.com/i29283
trinket1: http://www.thottbot.com/i29383
trinket2: http://www.thottbot.com/i28034

THIS GEAR IS NOT A ULTIMATE RULE I HAVE SELECTED IT TO WORK ONLY AS AN EXAMPLE THAT IT HAS EVERYTHING YOU NEED!

this is because you will have: 246+hit/16= 15.375% + you have 9%hit from talents= 24%hit YOU WON'T MISS AGAINST BOSSES WITH WHITE ATTACKS!
(Also read the patch notes about glansing hit changes)[read white damage] "as a personal note don't overlook +hit, this mistake number one most of the noobs make!"

You will also have: about 15% crit from gear, +5crit%from base charactersheet and +5%from talents, YOU WILL HAVE FLURRY ON WHOLE THE TIME
[read white damage]

This selection of items also gives you: 1168AP and your base ap is something like 400 or 500, let's assumpt it is 400, you would have 1568AP

Because of the mongoose procs(they usually proc so that you have both on at the same time) and flurry your attack speed would be 2.6-32%= 1.7
This is almost as good as it can be, but not under 1.5[read windfury]
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So no misses with white attacks against bosses->
You will have flurry and unleashed rage on constantly->
the raid benefits from you because of the improved windfury totem and improved str of earth totem(see the cyclone 2part set bonus)->
let's do some math, group consisting you, fury warrior, feral druid, and lets say 2rogues
1568AP + warriors improved battle shout 381 + your str-totem 113(shamans get 2ap from 1 strenght so 226) + feral druids leader of the pack 3crit
and a flask of relentless assault gives you

= 2294ap! (this can be even more if you have both mongooses,hourglass proc and bloodlust brooch use effect on)
so your attacks and windfurys are alot bigger than they are normally and you won't miss with whites
« Last Edit: September 04, 2007, 10:43:26 PM by Joggers »



Offline Nerdanel

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« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2007, 11:51:49 AM »
this stuff is great will help me out alot when I start questing in outland thanks:)
I might be small, But I always wear cool hats:p

Offline Joggers

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« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2007, 06:00:11 PM »
Quote from: Nerdanel
this stuff is great will help me out alot when I start questing in outland thanks:)

Always glad to be of some help  



Offline Nerdanel

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« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2007, 04:42:17 PM »
I was wondering if there are any usefull macro's for shammy's i'm complete useless when it comes to make them so if any one has tips bring them on  
I might be small, But I always wear cool hats:p

Offline Daffyd

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« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2007, 03:52:56 PM »
Quote
windfury tooltip says: "each HIT has a 20%chance of dealing..."
so as a simple conclusion the more you hit the more you get windfury attacks
you need aproximately 24% of hit in order not miss whit white attacks against bosses, so 9%from talents and 15%from gear.
Windfury has a hidden cooldown of 3 seconds, therefore a significant number of hits cannot proc windfury no matter what you do but this is irrelevant anyway.  Misses etc all count as "hits" on the attack table so 1 swing in 5 will proc windfury whether you have 0 hit or capped hit.  Only about 50% of an enhancement shaman's damage is white damage with the other 50% being yellow damage (windfury, stormstrike, and shocks) and two of these are effectively hit capped by talents alone (assuming you took 9% +hit from talents, if not you should consider respeccing immediately).  As +hit only affects 50% of your damage and AP/crit affects all of it you should feel free to not rate hit too highly.  It's nice, it's useful to have, but don't obsess over it.

This thread on the EJ forums is your class/spec bible: http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t13297-enhance...orycraft_vol_i/
« Last Edit: October 22, 2007, 04:18:19 PM by Daffyd »
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Offline Quarl's worshipper

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« Reply #19 on: October 24, 2007, 07:40:58 AM »
« Last Edit: October 24, 2007, 07:42:19 AM by jaxc »


My final clock for a while, now im using my 1600 mhz memry to 100% :D 50% FSB overclock ftw :D