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Author Topic: Druid nerf  (Read 548 times)

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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« on: February 24, 2007, 10:27:38 AM »
Can't be arsed to post the notes for 2.10, druid tanks got fucked in the ass just about every way possible.  MASSIVE damage nerf, armour nerf, health nerf, the only thing they gave us in return was more rage which is fudge all use as we're not exactly on the shiz end of that stick anyway.

Yes I'm pissed off.
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Offline TomTheWizard

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Druid nerf
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2007, 03:36:45 PM »
Well if like to see the notes, any chance of a link? And i am pissed of too (alorao is my drood).
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2007, 04:36:26 PM »
Quote
/    * When the duration of "Cyclone" ends, area buffs such as "Leader of the Pack", "Tree of Life", and "Moonkin" will now be correctly resumed.
Bug fix.
Quote
   * "Bear Form" now grants 25% increased stamina instead of 25% increased health.
Inconsequential.
Quote
   * "Dire Bear Form" now grants 25% increased stamina instead of 25% increased health. In addition, the armor bonus has been reduced from 450% to 400%.
Annoying but minor.
Quote
   * The multiplier on base weapon damage for "Mangle (Bear)" ability has been changed from 130% to 100%. In addition, the bonus damage has been reduced by the same ratio.
BIG nerf to bear tanking.
Quote
   * "Savage Fury" no longer affects "Mangle (Bear)".
    * "Savage Fury" no longer applies to "Maul" or "Swipe".
Entire talent is now a waste for a bear tank, a straight 20% damage nerf on our basic attacks.  The only things it now affects are mangle (cat), claw, and rake two of which I never use.
Quote
   * The critical damage bonus on "Predatory Instincts" reduced from 3/6/9/12/15% to 2/4/6/8/10%.
Minor nerf to cat damage, insult to injury for bear.
Quote
   * "Improved Leader of the Pack" can no longer get critical heals.
Inconsequential.
Quote
   * The armor bonus from "Moonkin Form" has been increased from 360% to 400% (to match Dire Bear Form).
Buff for balance druids.
Quote
   * The rage normalization equation has been adjusted to grant more rage.
I get more of something I had plenty of anyway, cheers.

Additionally the idol of brutality got nerfed by 80% for swipe from 50 damage to 10.

Before and after numbers below...

Mangle (Bear) Live: 682/1590
Mangle (Bear) Test: 443/978

Maul Live: 568/1309
Maul Test: 478/1046

No threat modifiers to compensate, even some of the warriors who called for a nerf to mangle are posting on the forums saying this is going WAY too far.

Full PTR patch notes at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/...patchnotes.html

Oh, and priests got the shaft too.  I think half the US priests got forum bans this morning after their reaction.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2007, 04:38:51 PM by Daffyd »
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Alandor

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Druid nerf
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2007, 05:08:26 PM »
someone at Blizz Needs a dagger in the back and no priest, druid or paladin to res them ¬_¬
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Offline TomTheWizard

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Druid nerf
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2007, 06:53:19 PM »
Well some nice iccle warrior and shaman buffs, as for druid, not so nice.
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Offline Taligecko

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Druid nerf
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2007, 11:43:57 PM »
FINALLY!

i dont feel so insignificant now

and come on, I mean, you must have realised a nerf was around the corner?
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Offline Aimlin

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Druid nerf
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2007, 12:09:45 AM »
Am quite happy with the addition of Thunder Clap for Def but more Rage, heh can't dump it fast enuff as it is
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2007, 12:16:52 AM »
<deleted>
« Last Edit: February 25, 2007, 11:29:45 AM by Daffyd »
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Offline Mordwin

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Druid nerf
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2007, 06:08:15 PM »
Not entirely unexpected... at first sight they seem to have slightly overdone it, but time will tell, and they may still tweak things.

It was fun while it lasted
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2007, 07:59:44 PM »
Quote from: Mordwin
Not entirely unexpected... at first sight they seem to have slightly overdone it, but time will tell, and they may still tweak things.

It was fun while it lasted  
Apparently even the devs thingk they may have overdone it with regards to tanking threat so it's being looked at very closely (although the patch will almost undoubtedly go to live as it is and be adjusted in the future).  If they give me a threat modifier to compensate I'll be happy, I really don't care about the PvP side as I'm almost always healing in BGs anyway.
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Offline rox0r

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Druid nerf
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2007, 10:20:09 PM »
Quote from: Daffyd
<deleted>

Come down off the ceiling yet then?  
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Offline Mordwin

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Druid nerf
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2007, 03:34:09 PM »
Quote from: Daffyd
Apparently even the devs thingk they may have overdone it with regards to tanking threat so it's being looked at very closely (although the patch will almost undoubtedly go to live as it is and be adjusted in the future).  If they give me a threat modifier to compensate I'll be happy, I really don't care about the PvP side as I'm almost always healing in BGs anyway.

We can but hope. I don't expect to be as good as a warrior at it, especially against multiple mobs, but I'd hope to be close against single mobs.
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2007, 11:47:41 AM »
There is a bug we've all noticed where the cat mangle sound sometimes happens in bear form, people went to test this to see if the cat mangle formula was being applied but the maths still don't quite add up.

While most bear mangles are within a reasonable range the occasional crit (not that rare but not all the time) is mathematically impossible by quite some way according to game mechanics.  Further testing is being done by a number of people but weird mangles way above the norm have been reported in player testing which would put them in the right range for the cat mangle formula but others fall between the two.

Still no conclusive evidence but it is becoming apparent that bear mangle sometimes does WAY more damage than it normally does (makes sense, my bear mangle crit record on a mob is half as much again as what I normally crit (1300-1400 if you were wondering) but I just thought I got lucky until I looked at the maths and realised it's not possible without deathwish/zerking etc).

No blue responses yet though, have to wait and see (and possibly respec feral tonight so I can check it for myself by mangling critters).

It would certainly explain why everyone has been saying "Bear mangle crits me for xxx" while all the druids are sat going "No way, not with gear anyone has on live".  We see more average crits than high ones as we're the ones doing them, everyone hit by a 2k+ mangle crit is going to remember it and moan loudly (rightly so really, that's not meant to happen).

Will have to see what comes of it, swipe will still get a kicking and I still want a threat modifier on it in return but if they leave the real mangle damage alone while fixing the apparent bugged super-crits I'll be happy.

Any volunteers to be a punchbag tonight for a bit of testing?

[edit]And another coding fix, apparently being cycloned in an arena makes you technically dead, 5 druids cycloning 5 opponents at the same time = instant arena win.  Hotfix going on live today.  Real good job they did with coding druids in TBC :/[/edit]
« Last Edit: February 27, 2007, 12:11:24 PM by Daffyd »
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2007, 09:41:11 AM »
Additional hotfix on top of the nerf...

    * The Druid ability Lacerate will now land a small amount of instant damage, causing it to generate threat against bleed-immune creatures.
    * The Druid ability Mangle (Bear) will now generate 50% bonus threat.

Not entirely happy until I see how bad swipe is tonight but overall much better than it would have been.

Also...

Quote
In addition, we examined concerns about the best Feral Druid armor pieces being outdoor world quest rewards, and Druids feeling their tanking ability would not scale with better gear. We are adjusting superior and epic leather pieces designed to be used by Bear Druids and increasing the armor on many of those items, particularly raid sets. These changes, however, will not show up until patch 2.1.0.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2007, 09:44:46 AM by Daffyd »
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Offline Aimlin

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Druid nerf
« Reply #14 on: March 07, 2007, 09:57:16 AM »
Having played/group with you a few times Daffyd, I know that you will adjust to the new "Build".  As you know, warriors have been nerfed many times, and I have always looked it as a way to challenge myself to play as well if not better.  To me a nerf would be "Druids must wear cloth, and all cloth will only have spirit now" this is an adjustment and I am sure the Seeds will adjust with it, hold back dmg that extra .3secs.  We will persevere
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2007, 10:16:32 AM »
Quote from: Aimlin
I am sure the Seeds will adjust with it, hold back dmg that extra .3secs
Single mob threat is going to be about the same as before for a mangle specced druid, maybe slightly lower but not a lot (mine will seem lower because I replaced a few bits of DPS type gear with uber-mitigation & stamina gear).  On bleed immune mobs threat will be significantly higher as Lacerate works on them now.  Multi target will be a LOT weaker but so long as I can keep the mobs off the healer(s) I'm happy.  Any DPS hitting the wrong target deserves a smack upside the head anyway

With so much of the threat coming from mangle it looks very much like they're trying to make druids have to spec 41 points into feral to be a competitive tank which is no bad thing.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2007, 10:17:35 AM by Daffyd »
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Offline Aimlin

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Druid nerf
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2007, 12:27:22 PM »
Quote from: Daffyd
 Any DPS hitting the wrong target deserves a smack upside the head anyway

That mage nuked for 1.6k again on an un-sundered mob...
Taunt, what Taunt button

           
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Offline rox0r

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Druid nerf
« Reply #17 on: March 07, 2007, 01:15:00 PM »
1.6k? Is that it? Pfff, mage deserves to be dead for being rubbish anyway  
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Alandor

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Druid nerf
« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2007, 02:00:15 PM »
after taking a break i don't know if i'll still be playing my druid but rather level up either a hunter rogue or a mage. but until Blizard actually do something to entice me back to my Druid poor alandor will be out of action for a while unless guildees need help when i'm back online. still, i'll be taking a break for a bit longer.
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Offline Daffyd

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Druid nerf
« Reply #19 on: March 07, 2007, 11:31:07 PM »
After tanking the Underbog (hardly a challenge I know) I can say single target threat is indeed about the same.  Multi target really did take a hit to the point where anyone hitting the wrong mob IS going to get a pasting but that's self inflicted damage so doesn't count

Without the hotfix it would have been a lot harder but I'm pretty ok with it as it stands.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2007, 11:31:58 PM by Daffyd »
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